Very annoyed to be here. I will write a bit about it. Bruno Barreiro, Pepe Diaz, Barbara Jordan, Audrey Edmonson, Jean Monestime and Lynda Bell are on the dais. Rebeca Sosa had to leave for a port thing. Right now the pool cleaners are complaining they shouldn't have to be licensed/certified. Professional pool guys want the licensing. Lynda Bell wants to get rid of licensing. She is such an idiot. No licensing then no insurance. So homeowners get screwed if there is an accident.
Pool discussion still going on. It is 3:17 Lynda Bell is speaking. I have been here since 2pm. Now Pepe. Lynda Bell won't get vote of Pepe and Jordan, who just spoke. Now Pepe is changing his mind. This is taking forever. 3:40 Jeffrey Bercow and Truly Burton just walked out (development interests). Rebeca is back and talking. She is asking Bell to follow-up with insurance for the pool cleaners. Monestime now talking. Monestime will vote with Bell. These are my guesses. Thank God it is almost over. Bell is talking again. She wants to move it to County Commission. Audrey supporting to move it on but will not give her support once at full commission without amendments. At 4 it passed 6 to 0 but a few Commissioners said it needs amendments.
Now they are talking about lifting the moratorium against annexation in the County. 4pm: Public hearing on lifting the Moratorium. Jeffrey Bercow (lawyer of choice for UDB moves) is back.
Sitting here is torture. I had a big chunk of toenail removed - more like torn out - yesterday that had been ingrown inside my toe. This feels similarly as awful just not as intense. I was just told that this is annexation also not just incorporation. It is 4:16 Mack Samuel just spoke in favor of incorporation. I like him. My back hurts. I am thirsty. 4:30 Pepe le Pew is talking, my thumbs are hurting. James Humble is still here. He is wearing white socks and his customary black shirt. Pepe is worried about opening the floodgate...yeah in his district. You have less control of your district with cities no wonder he doesn't want incorporation. Now Jordan is talking about cherry-picking incorporated areas 4:40. I have been here for almost 3 hours. Kerri Barsh is here-- rock mining lobbyist. She is sitting with James Humble.
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| Land Use Lawyer Jeffrey Bercow |
Pool discussion still going on. It is 3:17 Lynda Bell is speaking. I have been here since 2pm. Now Pepe. Lynda Bell won't get vote of Pepe and Jordan, who just spoke. Now Pepe is changing his mind. This is taking forever. 3:40 Jeffrey Bercow and Truly Burton just walked out (development interests). Rebeca is back and talking. She is asking Bell to follow-up with insurance for the pool cleaners. Monestime now talking. Monestime will vote with Bell. These are my guesses. Thank God it is almost over. Bell is talking again. She wants to move it to County Commission. Audrey supporting to move it on but will not give her support once at full commission without amendments. At 4 it passed 6 to 0 but a few Commissioners said it needs amendments.
Now they are talking about lifting the moratorium against annexation in the County. 4pm: Public hearing on lifting the Moratorium. Jeffrey Bercow (lawyer of choice for UDB moves) is back.
Sitting here is torture. I had a big chunk of toenail removed - more like torn out - yesterday that had been ingrown inside my toe. This feels similarly as awful just not as intense. I was just told that this is annexation also not just incorporation. It is 4:16 Mack Samuel just spoke in favor of incorporation. I like him. My back hurts. I am thirsty. 4:30 Pepe le Pew is talking, my thumbs are hurting. James Humble is still here. He is wearing white socks and his customary black shirt. Pepe is worried about opening the floodgate...yeah in his district. You have less control of your district with cities no wonder he doesn't want incorporation. Now Jordan is talking about cherry-picking incorporated areas 4:40. I have been here for almost 3 hours. Kerri Barsh is here-- rock mining lobbyist. She is sitting with James Humble.
Audrey Edmonson moved lifting the moratorium forward. Bruno seconded. Now Pepe and Jordan want another friggin' hit on the yapping. It is almost 5 pm. 5:15 moved to Commision by 3 to 2 (Jordan and Diaz against). Gimleteye takes over below (thank the Lord!).
Gimleteye reports:
2 hours, 15 minutes after meeting begins, the UDB is finally taken up. Lots of people had left by this time. Me, included.
Barbara Falsey, president of Urban Environment League: "Supports the proposed moratorium on applications to move the UDB. Timely. Will afford professional planning staff to potentially implement the EPA study on UDB. Extremely good idea. Wrong time for a special "working group". Would be unable to reach a consensus better than your professional staff. The Watershed Study is an example of staffing a work group that doesn't get the job done.
Ag representatives ask for a position on whatever "working group" is assembled.
Sara Fain, Everglades Law Center: "Supports the moratorium. Now is not the time to move the UDB. Let this serve as an opportunity (ie. UDB moratorium) to leverage infill and revitalization of existing communities. So far as "working group" is concerned, there is no outcome that could create a "permanent" UDB. South Miami Dade Watershed Study. County commission EPA study: Uphold existing UDB. It is doubtful that any group could come to a consensus. Two of the members who are "listed" or "mentioned": they would like to respectfully decline to participate in the task force at this time.
Jeffrey Bercow representing developers: objects to moratorium. "Developers want a fair shake. Level playing field. This ordinance will prevent us from making our arguments in the future. No matter how "good" or "jobs we might create", the ordinance prevents us from submitting our justification. Etc. Etc. Question of need: the county commission approved the EAR last year. We are running out of space. Etc. Etc. ... A 2015 moratorium would practically extend to 2019. This lack of availability will artificially increase cost of housing. Affect workforce housing. Lack of affordability. Mayor Gimenez called this ordinance a moratorium: it must be of a limited short duration. 3 years is too long! Moratorium must serve a legitimate public purpose. What is the legitimate public purpose of this ordinance? No justification. The ordinance proposes to eliminate a right. Vote it down today. We are in support of the "task force". Never hurts to try to reach a consensus besides my doubts we will ever reach a consensus."
William Delgado, president of Latin American Business Association: 20 years I have been in this chamber discussing the UDB. I blame our industry for being here 20 years later. Because the politicians we support don't represent our interests when they are elected. I received a lot of phone calls. I ask you one more time to create a "task force", equally balanced, let's discuss this once and for all.
Truly Burton, for the builders: we are voted down time and again. What is the crisis? We are opposed to this ordinance. Rigorous standards in place now. Wants to "dialogue". Has personal doubts about the ability of a "working group".
Latin Builders Association: We are in favor of sitting down and seeing what needs to be done. I am skeptical of a "working group". Vote moratorium down.
5:38PM public meeting is closed.
Edmonson: what is supposed to occur during the UDB moratorium? I can't see putting a moratorium and no one is telling me what we are supposed to do during a moratorium? It is not telling me anything. I don't know what is going to happen two or three or fours years down the road. What might be needed by 2015? I cannot support this unless I see what we are supposed to do.
Item fails without a motion.
Motion to create a "working group", item 2 A.
Pepe Diaz: The UDB created to make sure things done reasonable and through a very strenuous process. (Since 1989, 9 UDB applications approved out of 39. Five UDB applications approved in last 10 years.) The more balance we find in this, the better this will be. The idea is to have a sit-down discussion between all the groups to then look at the studies that have been done, with studies that have taken place. Pepe Diaz dismisses the environmental groups who just say, no. People talking differences, but something gets resolved one way or another. I think it is time, once and for all, for this discussion to take place. It is not about the UDB line: it is about how things get done. There is money on both sides. The bottom line is that applications were provided. Pepe talks about high school he was going to get for Lowe's but it did not get done. Even having the votes. Something went wrong. Democracy is also about speaking and to find understanding. I am tired of the fighting. Let's get something discussed. Balance is very important in this. Everyone's position is extremely important. What kind of infrastructure is there. What needs to be. People are just going through a process, and at the end of the day something has to give. Pepe wants to add amendments.
Amendments: "after input from owners of property outside the UDB". Additional member: agricultural member.
I will find what other groups are there to fill that balance. I will put other groups in.
Monestine: I don't like this item as I didn't the other one. Less than 20 percent of applications have gone through. I didn't support the previous item, because this board has held its own line in regards to the UDB. I think this may support just a conversation to have a conversation, but not the well intentioned result that Commissioner Diaz wants to have. Third issue: I don't think 90 days is enough to provide a substantial or good report. Fourth: this probably encourages us to have a better discussion in regards to issues regarding urban development in particular. You know what-- the point about needing more land, this doesn't stand well with me. We can redevelop. Another issue I have: there may be many organizations within the county regarding the urban community that are not represented in this "working group": these organizations are more interested in development within the boundary line. We need a serious conversation about bringing more development in the urban communities. I understand that it is cheaper to build outside the UDB, for various reasons: I think we need to put more focus on policies and practices driving investment within the UDB and we will do a better service. Instead of these political exercises. I can't support this.
Barreiro: I support the item. You should be looking at this as a positive process. The UDB line has been stable. You are assuring the community has a second line. It is not going to be one inch away from the Everglades. There is going to be a buffer: ranchettes, agriculture. (WTF is he talking about?) It will do proper master planning. Right now it is piecemeal.
Jordan: The word "permanent"and "unanimous" I tend not to vote consistently on the UDB. I vote my conscience. Where I feel I need to go. (Florida City Commons?) Maybe something that is truly, truly needed and wanted in a community that surrounds it. The unanimous could keep something great, out. I just feel we are putting ourselves into a box. I would like Pepe Diaz to lock ourselves out. Even though your community may show up, one vote could stop it from happening.
Diaz: The idea here is to look for discussion. To hear discussion. To put more distance? At the end of the day we want to know what is there and what is going to be. To Monestine; I would rather add than subtract. More groups. (OMG) To Commissioner Barreiro: the Green Belt was the permanent buffer. Broward County built to the edge. We don't want that. But we want what is sensible. Jobs in our community. We are going to run out of land, staff tells us. It is not only about the line, it is about the process. That is what this is about: this is about discussing. Monestine hasn't seen the racial slurs in UDB controversies (WTF?) in the chamber, nearly fist fights. All the interested groups. Including the schools, Everyone EVERYONE. Diaz maybe big discussion to say, no, to each other. This is work in progress still. This is not a true given already. This a board of play and the board can be changed.
The final vote was BRUNO BARREIRO, PEPE LE PEW DIAZ, AUDREY EDMONSON and BARBARA JORDAN sent Pepe's resolution to the full Board. JEAN MONESTIME SAID NO. SOSA was absent. Thanks go to Jean Monestime.
Pepe Diaz's suggested members for the advisory committee:
10 members
Environmental & Land Use Law Center
Tropical Audubon
Urban Environment League
that is 3 membrs from the environmental side.
---------
The other side has 6:
Latin Builders
South Florida Builders Association
Associated Builders and Contractors
Miami Chamber
Beacon Council
Agriculture
...Pepe claims that the Chamber and Beacon council are neutral parties.
Ag representatives ask for a position on whatever "working group" is assembled.
Sara Fain, Everglades Law Center: "Supports the moratorium. Now is not the time to move the UDB. Let this serve as an opportunity (ie. UDB moratorium) to leverage infill and revitalization of existing communities. So far as "working group" is concerned, there is no outcome that could create a "permanent" UDB. South Miami Dade Watershed Study. County commission EPA study: Uphold existing UDB. It is doubtful that any group could come to a consensus. Two of the members who are "listed" or "mentioned": they would like to respectfully decline to participate in the task force at this time.
Jeffrey Bercow representing developers: objects to moratorium. "Developers want a fair shake. Level playing field. This ordinance will prevent us from making our arguments in the future. No matter how "good" or "jobs we might create", the ordinance prevents us from submitting our justification. Etc. Etc. Question of need: the county commission approved the EAR last year. We are running out of space. Etc. Etc. ... A 2015 moratorium would practically extend to 2019. This lack of availability will artificially increase cost of housing. Affect workforce housing. Lack of affordability. Mayor Gimenez called this ordinance a moratorium: it must be of a limited short duration. 3 years is too long! Moratorium must serve a legitimate public purpose. What is the legitimate public purpose of this ordinance? No justification. The ordinance proposes to eliminate a right. Vote it down today. We are in support of the "task force". Never hurts to try to reach a consensus besides my doubts we will ever reach a consensus."
William Delgado, president of Latin American Business Association: 20 years I have been in this chamber discussing the UDB. I blame our industry for being here 20 years later. Because the politicians we support don't represent our interests when they are elected. I received a lot of phone calls. I ask you one more time to create a "task force", equally balanced, let's discuss this once and for all.
Truly Burton, for the builders: we are voted down time and again. What is the crisis? We are opposed to this ordinance. Rigorous standards in place now. Wants to "dialogue". Has personal doubts about the ability of a "working group".
Latin Builders Association: We are in favor of sitting down and seeing what needs to be done. I am skeptical of a "working group". Vote moratorium down.
5:38PM public meeting is closed.
Edmonson: what is supposed to occur during the UDB moratorium? I can't see putting a moratorium and no one is telling me what we are supposed to do during a moratorium? It is not telling me anything. I don't know what is going to happen two or three or fours years down the road. What might be needed by 2015? I cannot support this unless I see what we are supposed to do.
Item fails without a motion.
Motion to create a "working group", item 2 A.
Pepe Diaz: The UDB created to make sure things done reasonable and through a very strenuous process. (Since 1989, 9 UDB applications approved out of 39. Five UDB applications approved in last 10 years.) The more balance we find in this, the better this will be. The idea is to have a sit-down discussion between all the groups to then look at the studies that have been done, with studies that have taken place. Pepe Diaz dismisses the environmental groups who just say, no. People talking differences, but something gets resolved one way or another. I think it is time, once and for all, for this discussion to take place. It is not about the UDB line: it is about how things get done. There is money on both sides. The bottom line is that applications were provided. Pepe talks about high school he was going to get for Lowe's but it did not get done. Even having the votes. Something went wrong. Democracy is also about speaking and to find understanding. I am tired of the fighting. Let's get something discussed. Balance is very important in this. Everyone's position is extremely important. What kind of infrastructure is there. What needs to be. People are just going through a process, and at the end of the day something has to give. Pepe wants to add amendments.
Amendments: "after input from owners of property outside the UDB". Additional member: agricultural member.
I will find what other groups are there to fill that balance. I will put other groups in.
Monestine: I don't like this item as I didn't the other one. Less than 20 percent of applications have gone through. I didn't support the previous item, because this board has held its own line in regards to the UDB. I think this may support just a conversation to have a conversation, but not the well intentioned result that Commissioner Diaz wants to have. Third issue: I don't think 90 days is enough to provide a substantial or good report. Fourth: this probably encourages us to have a better discussion in regards to issues regarding urban development in particular. You know what-- the point about needing more land, this doesn't stand well with me. We can redevelop. Another issue I have: there may be many organizations within the county regarding the urban community that are not represented in this "working group": these organizations are more interested in development within the boundary line. We need a serious conversation about bringing more development in the urban communities. I understand that it is cheaper to build outside the UDB, for various reasons: I think we need to put more focus on policies and practices driving investment within the UDB and we will do a better service. Instead of these political exercises. I can't support this.
Barreiro: I support the item. You should be looking at this as a positive process. The UDB line has been stable. You are assuring the community has a second line. It is not going to be one inch away from the Everglades. There is going to be a buffer: ranchettes, agriculture. (WTF is he talking about?) It will do proper master planning. Right now it is piecemeal.
Jordan: The word "permanent"and "unanimous" I tend not to vote consistently on the UDB. I vote my conscience. Where I feel I need to go. (Florida City Commons?) Maybe something that is truly, truly needed and wanted in a community that surrounds it. The unanimous could keep something great, out. I just feel we are putting ourselves into a box. I would like Pepe Diaz to lock ourselves out. Even though your community may show up, one vote could stop it from happening.
Diaz: The idea here is to look for discussion. To hear discussion. To put more distance? At the end of the day we want to know what is there and what is going to be. To Monestine; I would rather add than subtract. More groups. (OMG) To Commissioner Barreiro: the Green Belt was the permanent buffer. Broward County built to the edge. We don't want that. But we want what is sensible. Jobs in our community. We are going to run out of land, staff tells us. It is not only about the line, it is about the process. That is what this is about: this is about discussing. Monestine hasn't seen the racial slurs in UDB controversies (WTF?) in the chamber, nearly fist fights. All the interested groups. Including the schools, Everyone EVERYONE. Diaz maybe big discussion to say, no, to each other. This is work in progress still. This is not a true given already. This a board of play and the board can be changed.
The final vote was BRUNO BARREIRO, PEPE LE PEW DIAZ, AUDREY EDMONSON and BARBARA JORDAN sent Pepe's resolution to the full Board. JEAN MONESTIME SAID NO. SOSA was absent. Thanks go to Jean Monestime.
Pepe Diaz's suggested members for the advisory committee:
10 members
Environmental & Land Use Law Center
Tropical Audubon
Urban Environment League
that is 3 membrs from the environmental side.
---------
The other side has 6:
Latin Builders
South Florida Builders Association
Associated Builders and Contractors
Miami Chamber
Beacon Council
Agriculture
...Pepe claims that the Chamber and Beacon council are neutral parties.
18 comments:
Licensed professionals are essential. Only trained first-responders are capable of addressing complex swimming pool incidents. Remember the Baby Ruth scene in Caddyshack?
You can get injured by the chemicals...who can you hold responsible if no insurance?
I am going to make a broad assumption here that common sense can protect consumers from pool cleaners. Should we be licensing our maids too.
Sorry, Genius, I don't think government can protect people form stupidity. This would be the stupid pot calling the stupid kettle black.
Love ya anyway.
Licensing makes services cost more. This about money, not safety.
They want another advisory group? What are they going to do keep forming groups to study the UDB until they get the answer they want? They are trying to wear the greenies down.
On the moritorium issue: Didn't
Property Rights Hard-liner, Jas Humble tell Linda Bell to leave as this issue might spoil her
recent Hmstd Motor Sports Speedway UDB decision? Humble, sitting on Ag Practices Bd. has been holding her hand, even through the 8 1/2 mile DERM debacle. It all spells,
like years ago, "dialing for dollars"
Ole dude
I remember growing up as a teenager, one of my many chores at home was to clean the pool.
I had to clean it up, mix the chemicals and add the appropriate amount of chlorine myself - who taught me? The guys at "pinch-a-penny."
No certification, no liscence, no extra fees, nada. You could "eat off" the bottom of my pool it was so clean. And nobody got "sick" as Pepe Le Pew implied.
I totally agree with the anon above. This is all about money. Even some of the regular "Joes" admitted today - the big companies hire us (the unliscensed and uncertified pool cleaners) at meager wages.
If force them all to adhere to these new regs, they will simply charge the consumer more and many independent folks will lose their jobs - Excellent Work Commissioners!
Man, I can't wait for November!
Thanks for being there. Keep them accountable
What did Suarez say about his 3 year moratorium? Was he sincere about holding the line?
Suarez curiously didn't show up to support his own ordinance. Lynda Bell came to support hers. Edmonson asked deputy mayor(?) Osterholtz about Suarez's reason for suggesting it and he sort of shrugged. I don't think Suarez was serious, it just gave Pepe le Pew a spring board for his dumb advisory board. So it made it worse for hold the line.
If the pool guy trips at your house and gets covered in chemicals and has no insurance he will try to collect from you. If he does something that burns out your pool motor you won't get compensated. Just tellin ya.
Is Suarez serious about anything? So far he's proposed lots of grand projects - like fabulous entrance gates to Little Havana? But what does he believe in? Where is he on real issues facing his district? He might be surprised to find himself with opposition in this falls election.
Suarez, to quote from a Simon & Garfunkel song: still crazy after all these years.
The election is August, not Fall, for Xman's seat. Only if there is a runoff will it go to November.
The pool guys need to be certified by taking a couple of hour course and taking an OPEN BOOK test. Big deal on that.
They all were for Pepe's advisory group.
You forget the thousands of dollars in County fees the pool guys will be charged along with that open book test.
Yea, let's stick it to the little guy, AGAIN!
No they weren't "all for" Pepe's advisory group. Gimlet got it right. Monestime spoke against it and was the lone dissenting vote. He pointed out that it was a stupid idea and a waste of time. He was just nicer about it that I would have been.
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